Monday, June 25, 2012

04 1960 Armour Coins Part 2

Picking up where we left off, lets look at the 1960 Armour colors from a standpoint of Mantle coins.

The key to 1960 Mantle coins is having a complete back rim which we shall discuss below.
Transparent /translucent coins are much rarer than their opaque counterparts.

Below is a  list of Mantles that I have or have seen.

Red: common color but very difficult to find with complete rims (more on that below)
trans Red: never seen one for any coin

Red Orange: common color

trans Red/orange: seen it for many of the other 1960s but not Mantle

Orange: very rare color - SFLA Yank has a MAntle in bright orange
trans orange ??

Yellow : plenty of these avaiable
trans yellow - rare, never seen one with complete rims

Pale Blue - common color many available with complete rims
trans pale blue - rare, I have Mantle, Fox, Crandall & Malzone

Royal Blue - common color - never seen one with complete back rims
royal blue trans - never seen one

Navy Blue - rare a few with rims are available
trans navy blue - have one Mantle ungraded also a Banks and Crandall.

Aqua - very rare but available with complete rims
trans aqua - never seen for any player

slate blue - very rare opaque coin never seen with complete rims
trans slate blue ??

lime green - common color, many of them with complete rims
trans lime green - rare color, I have Mantle and most of he others

medium green - rarer for Mantle
trans med green -rare color,  have not seen one for Mantle

dark green - common color most have complete rim
trans dk green - appear to be 50/50 opaque vs trans

Now lets talk about the partial rims. This is a phenomina that shows up only for 1960 coins and only for the Aaron group. For whatever reason it is most pronounced for Mantle coins.

I acually found one that was intact with its offset rim "hanging by a thread". Pics of the front and back are below:

From the back pic you can see the thin sliver of plastic hanging off the coin with a nick already having broken off. The rim edge must be offset in the mold that these are formed from, but why this is so shall forever be named unknown. Why the Mantle coin so much more than the rest ?

Early on in the grading process at PSA, they started grading these partial rim coins as high as PSA 9's. !

After discussions with Bob Lemke of the Std Catalog of BB Cards he added the following text to his description of the coins which is still there to date and says in essence "..a partial rim coin should not be graded higher than a very good."

In the fall of 2005 sflayank, I and others petitioned Joe Orlando to correct the PSA grading process and regrade coins they had screwed up. The final response from PSA was:

"We have discussed this at length and do not agree with the Standard Catalogue’s assessment.  

While we think the reverse is a factor (the degree that a small piece may be missing), we do not feel that warrants dropping the grade harshly.  Perhaps the coins should be precluded from reaching a “10” for instance but we see no reason to knock a coin to a mid or low grade due to a minor manufacturer defect that does not affect the overall eye appeal very much. 

Take care and I do appreciate your candor,"

hummmmm.. Would they do this for cards ?? Not hardly.  At the very least these coins should be labeled OC. . Anyway, buyer beware when you buy Mantle coins even if they have been PSA graded.

Next lets look at the mystery coin of 1960 - the Bud Daley coin. For many years it has been known as the rarest of all Armour coins. This probably is not true. The rarest coin is most likely the 1955 Mantle spelled correct L-R (which we shall discuss in the future). The Daley has widely been placed into the Allison group so there should be a red/orange; a regular yellow and a mustard yellow at the least. I have seen a mustard yellow but do not own one myself. Below are the red/orange and yellow coins.

Are there any other colors ? Maybe, here is a comparison of two Daleys that I have. The one on the right is the normal red/orange. The one on the left is not Salmon, but it sure isnt traditional red/orange !

 Lastly there are the so called Daley "test" colors . These popped up in ~ 2005 and supposedly were test colors that were one of a kind items made in 1960. The early auctions saw these coins going for > $1200 each.

The colors that I have seen include the ones shown below including:    black, clear, green, bright yelow, white, grey, olive green, bright red.  I have also seen navy, brown and probably a few others. Keeping track of these for the past 7 years (especially since they started getting graded) I can tell you that there are at least 3 of each except the completely clear. I have only seen one of those, it was graded PSA 10 and I still own it. The olive, grey, white, yellow and a navy blue have passed through my hands and I have made money buying and then selling these.

Pricing for these have steadily come down and I'm now seeing them go for $ ~ 400.

Another thing I can tell you is that the plastic used for these is NOT the same as that used for production of the coins in 55, 59 or 60. The way you can tell this is by droping the coins onto a wooden surface. The "test" coins have more of a plunk sound to them. If you have one try it. Why would anyone test out new colors with a different plastic ?

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